using a 1995 block, it has cam retainer plate. ( roller cam block, and using comp roller hyd cam)
which timing set is recommended,?
blower motor, street car, NOT race car,
single roller chain? double roller chain? iron gear, billet gear?
and timing cover, It came with plastic one, use it, or will others work,
heard double roller won't fit in stock cover?
BillK Guru
Posts: 1834 Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:30 pm Location: Beautiful Southern Maryland Contact:
Post by BillK » Tue Apr 12, 2022 9:27 pm
I just use the Cloyes stock replacement set. They last forever. I would normally use the single roller "motorcycle" chain set with the retainer plate cam.
If you decide to use a double roller you will absolutely have to grind the boss around the upper middle oil galley to clear the chain.
Bill Koustenis
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md
Post by swampbuggy » Tue Apr 12, 2022 9:42 pm
Yes Bill, been there and have done that modifying , Mark H.
Justa1time HotPass
Posts: 181 Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:22 am Location: Redmond, Oregon
Post by Justa1time » Tue Apr 12, 2022 11:10 pm
I too have been looking for a factory roller cam timing chain solution that has adjustability and is a nicely manufactured piece. Something pre stretched would be ideal! I am not the biggest fan of the VORTEC Style plastic timing chain cover either- something with a removable top half would be nice to have. Let me know what you find! Cloyes Gear 9-3157 has been something I am considering. I may order it up- it has three adjustment settings is all. Idk. I am subscribed to this thread.
Bryan from oregon
Geoff2 GuruPost by Geoff2 » Wed Apr 13, 2022 3:19 am
The chain itself is under the most load so get a brand that uses quality chain, such as Jwis. Rollmaster premium t/c set.
alotadust New MemberPost by alotadust » Wed Apr 13, 2022 11:55 am
so I can assume the step/ cut on the nose of the cam, moves the timing gear closer to the block?
I see there is available a single roller ( but larger links) anyone have experience with that one?
or just stick with whats known reliable- double roller.
and clearance the block.
single roller got me thinking, thats whats on most motorcycles,
and they do stretch alot, hmmm
Post by rfoll » Wed Apr 13, 2022 12:24 pm
There is a quality double roller made for the application. I called Summit and they gave me a part number. I don't remember the brand anymore. Grinding the clearance is no big deal unless the motor is assembled. Installing a conventional cover is not a problem. Most of the blocks are missing 2 threaded holes, but you can drill them if you want. Some blocks have the locating dowels, but anymore I drill the hole in the cover larger and use a dummy balancer to center the seal. I have seen the seal end up over 1/8" eccentric.
So much to do, so little time.BillK Guru
Posts: 1834 Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:30 pm Location: Beautiful Southern Maryland Contact:
Post by BillK » Wed Apr 13, 2022 12:40 pm
alotadust wrote: ↑ Wed Apr 13, 2022 11:55 am
single roller got me thinking, thats whats on most motorcycles,
and they do stretch alot, hmmm
The single roller chains last forever. I have seen Mercruiser engines with over 1000 hours on them and the chains are barely stretched. I have never seen a problem with the plastic cover either. Just replace the entire cover with a new one from GM. A new cover with seal and o-ring is less than $50. Why make it harder than it needs to be .
Bill Koustenis
Advanced Automotive Machine
Waldorf Md
Post by swampbuggy » Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:11 pm
What is the intended usage of this Engine ? Mark H. swampbuggy GuruPost by swampbuggy » Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:12 pm
Sorry, i pulled the trigger to quick, Street Car . ProPower engines GuruPost by ProPower engines » Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:36 pm
Cloyes sells a double true roller set with and without a billet top gear that does not need any grinding of the block.
There is a large recess behind the top gear to clear the retainer plate and upper oil gallery plug area of the block.
I use them all the time in late vortec style blocks as they are also available in -.005 and -.010 lengths for line honed blocks.
Engine Pro also sells a very good timing set with the same design and in -.005 and -.010 for line honed blocks.
No I do not have the part numbers handy but you can call directly and talk to their techs for that info.
Beware of the plastic covers as some have a less number of mounting bolts and will leak over time as they warp on street stuff but the better quality chain tends to throw the oil at the cover sealing area harder then a single chain does.
I don't use the stock type chain because they are worth about 4-6 degrees of retarded cam timing depending on the block.
And the single roller chain is loose to start with even from brand new factory assembly they are about 4-6 degrees of slack is And the worst I have seen 2-4 is the best I have seen on new factory crate engines they claim are hand built.
Post by rebelyell » Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:38 pm
alotadust wrote: ↑ Tue Apr 12, 2022 6:40 pm using a 1995 block, it has cam retainer plate. ( roller cam block, and using comp roller hyd cam)
which timing set is recommended,?
blower motor, street car, NOT race car,
single roller chain? double roller chain? iron gear, billet gear?
and timing cover, It came with plastic one, use it, or will others work,
heard double roller won't fit in stock cover?
Do You Require 3-way or 9-way advance-retard set or otherwise adjustable set . Or simply straight up .
ProPower engines GuruPost by ProPower engines » Wed Apr 13, 2022 10:06 pm
The sets I mentioned from engine pro come with billet top and bottom and seamless true roller chain.
And a 9 keyway lower gear. They are very good quality and a 1/4 the cost of cloyes stuff and better made.
Something that cloyes does not offer.
Post by alotadust » Thu Apr 14, 2022 1:15 pm
ok, so I bought 2 timing sets, one with single row chain, and another with double row and torrington bearing,
both are for factory roller cam motors, 1 is cloyes, the other is SA
I prefer to install the cam straight up, (cam is.222/.228@.050 on 113LC)
will degree it to see where its at,
block is still bare, so clearancing is not a problem,
I did drill the galley plugs ( both of them) with .030 oil holes.
so will be oiling the timing chain .
also bought a tin timing cover,
I see a fair amount of test fitting in the future, LOL
thx for the input!
Bill Chase HotPass
Posts: 480 Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:11 pm Location: Michigan
Post by Bill Chase » Thu Apr 14, 2022 2:03 pm
Cloyes hex-a-just 9-3145a double roller is a nice piece for the factory roller cam stuff, but will not fit the vortec cover. I used it with their 2 piece cover, had to mill it down to clear the short water pump, then mill the removable cover slightly but it fit, doesn't rub, and allows access to change the cam timing +/- 6° without having to mess with the oil pan seal. Their factory replacement for the 96-02 5.7 is a good piece but doesn't offer any adjustability. You can always drill the cam gear and use the old offset dowel pins to get +/- 3-4° if ordering a custom cam having it ground with the advance/retard you want could get it close to dot to dot installed, still best to degree it and know though. I wish they offered it in a single roller for 96-02 vortec application but they don't. The gm performance parts piece for the 602/604 crate engines is also a good piece for stepped nose roller camshaft but doesn't offer any adjustability. I'll probably use it for my current build and drill it for use with dowels. If you need to keep the stock vortec cover and reluctor your choices are limited. Efi connection has some double roller sets that are supposed to work with the reluctor, but requires their billet cover. Of course none of this is an issue if you don't need the reluctor or factory cover. Sometimes you can double stack gaskets with silicone and get a double roller chain to fit the vortec cover according to some old posts at thirdgen website. But haven't personally tried that. Keep in mind if you want to use a non vortec balancer you'll need to mill the thickness of the reluctor off the back of the balancer to keep pulley/belt alignment right, or space out accessories.
